I believe it’s possible to believe, as many Christians do, that homesexuality is wrong, whilst not being homophobic. Nevertheless many Christians are prejudice against gay people, and use their faith as a justification for it. Other people are insensitive though lack of understanding.

These questions are designed to put you on the spot - and feel how it might be, to have someone you’ve just met asking intrusive questions, and making ignorant assumptions.

Believeing something is wrong is one thing, being comfortable with discrimnation and prejudice as a result of that is not - and that why I like these. Steve

Sorry, I don’t get it. I’ve spent my entire life asking intrusive questions to people I’ve just met (it’s my job). As for ignorant assumptions, well, that makes the world go around, doesn’t it?

http://arguewithsigns.net/mt/archives/001506.html

The questions don’t put me on the spot. They are too cute by half.

This also puzzles me:
I believe it’s possible to believe, as many Christians do, that homesexuality is wrong, whilst not being homophobic. Nevertheless many Christians are prejudice against gay people, and use their faith as a justification for it. Other people are insensitive though lack of understanding.

How do you separate the two? How can one be one without being accused of being the other? I’m curious, because I’d like to think that I’m the former, but I’d be accused of being the latter.

On the separation: maybe it’s wishful thinking, because most of my friends in church would hod to that position.

Still, I think that it’s possible to come to an honest conclusion that homosexuality is wring in the eyes of God, and yet not allow that to affact how you treat people who are gay, and more than any sin would affect how you treat anyone else.

I would hope that I could bring my gay friends to church, where people do disagree, and not have people jump on them or shun them.

On the other hand a lot of Christians wouldn;t do that. and in their defence against accusatsions of prejudice often do fall and play into the same old inaccurate stereotypes.

I’ve spoken about this with a couple of my gay friends, and whilst they would still be impacted by someone who beleived that, they recognise the personal integrity there. Not everyone would, but I think it’s a good place to be.

Make any sense? Steve

But I think that the idea is a good one. I believe that the church generally elevates some sins/behaviours/issues over others, and I have commented on this before. One of the reasons I believe this happens for the issues like homosexuality is that it is easy to slip into “us and them” mode - the behaviour is engaged in by a discrete group of people that we can point at and name, whilst there is a minimal chance that we will be in that group some time in the future.

So I like the idea of trying to place ourselves in the other position and gauge whether we are engaging with the issue in a sensitive way.

It is something we all had to do and if honest continue to do each day and particularly on Sunday

We do all have to repent, continually, but God tends to work on us in stages. God accepts me as a work in progress, and when I became a Christian we began a slow process of working on different things, some are only just coming up, and while some came up straight away.

Very often the church does exactly what you say though and demands that anyone coming to church repents of any and every ‘visible’ sin, instantly, and as if dealt with forever.

That’s not God’s way, he allows us to be real people. I like to do the same. That’s not pretending about what we believe is a sin and what is not, it’s simply letting people be while we learn who they are, and as they begin to process that we are all in of finding God and becoming more like Jesus.

As a pre-emtive for your quoting of Jesus ’sin no more’, I’m not Jesus, neither are you. Jesus has a special authority and presence that none of us have fully. He also said that he did only what his father taught him, - and I suspect that there are many people he didn’t address so directly. On the same basis I would address some stuff instantly, only if my father tells me so.

Certainly the disciples lives (if we only go on the text itself), with unadressed pride for a long time, - and as I’ve heard you say a number of times, one sin isn’t elevated above others.

Steve

I think that’s possible, and I hope that would be the way I would approach things. I don’t currently have any homosexual friends - that I know of (I refuse to use the term “gay”), although I have had some in the past.

But I think you run the risk of not actually standing against things that are wrong in this approach. To give you an example: sex outside of marriage. If you believe it is wrong, and you continue to be friends with people who are engaging in that behavior - and never mention that you think it’s wrong - how do they know that it’s wrong? Do you just “wait until it clears up” and hope they come to their senses, despite the fact that you believe it is damaging to their spiritual lives? Or do you just ignore the whole issue, and treat them as if they were just a boyfriend and girlfriend (or even as if they were married)? If so, aren’t you just deluding yourself and them?

I don’t believe we’re all perfect, or that we are all sinless every time we leave the sanctuary. I don’t say this about homosexuality exclusively, either. And I would somewhat disagree with Dan’s “us and them” explanation. Homosexuality is similar to adultery and divorce in that these are “sin questions” that deal with sexuality, the most personal thing outside of prayer that a person does with another human being. Sexuality is one point at which we are really at one with the creator, engaged in the creative act of (possibly) creating another human being (leaving aside the issue of birth control). So naturally, sins and societal changes that surround that are going to be of particular concern. I know a number of churches that preach as strongly against adultery and divorce as tehy do against homosexual marriage (perhaps even stronger).

On the other hand, I think it is impossible these days to have a situation like you propose and really state your oppositional belief.

This is probably rambling. Sorry.

I agree there is that line which is easy to cross. If it was a good friend of mine who got into an adulterous relationship, then I’m sure I would talk to him about it. If it was someone I had just met though - well, I don’t even know them, how can I speak into their life unless God specifically asks me to?

It does make life harder than just shouting at them, and the risk you mention is real, but I think we have to walk these lines to be like Jesus.

Out of curisoisty - why don’t you use the word GAY. As I understand it it’s an anacronym of Good As You, from the 60’s, which is certainly true. Be interested to know? Steve

Steve