hillsongs - the next installment
As the comments in two weeks have gone beyond 500 comments - here is the new thread..
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Recent entries
October 3rd, 2006 at 3:54 pm
Jesus is my Superhero.
http://images.hairslime.multiply.com/song/1/6/full/U2FsdGVkX195OzolYJEeyboj7hyOYfBMyUE9S97Bhs0qro8AOnkWQg==/06%20Superhero.mp3
October 3rd, 2006 at 10:52 pm
Thanks guys.
To curb the confusion bay’s name is “Teah Grace” (”Tay-ah”).
-She is incredibly beautiful. Long venomous barbs and all.
October 4th, 2006 at 8:44 am
Beautiful name - in Greek its derivitive of the feminine for Theos - God, although I imagine you knew that (pointing it out more for everyone else) - So the grace of God in a little girl…that is beautiful. And the fact that there is a ‘G’ in her name means that I will forever believe that she is named after me!
October 4th, 2006 at 10:26 am
i actually got throught that whole song without punching my computer lance
hillsong at its worst endevouring to make Jesus trendy
October 5th, 2006 at 12:10 am
:Sometimes churches are kept artificially alive. There are no vital signs of life such as souls getting saved, enthusiasm, anointing, presence of God. These churches need either to be closed or replanted.
Usually this is done by fresh inspirational leadership that comes in and proceeds to restructure the church.
One of our churches on the south-western side of Sydney was in this predicament. Brian Houston was sent to bury the old church and raise up a new one. Liverpool Assembly of God became Liverpool Christian Life Centre. With new vision, new leadership, new direction and new foundations, this church is now one of Sydney’s strongest churches under the anointed leadership of John McMartin.”
From a Church Planting Manual by Pastor John Iuliano (North Shore Christian Centre, Sydney)
http://www.christian-faith.com/html/page/church_planting_manual
October 5th, 2006 at 2:08 am
“The number of hermeneutical problems that I have encountered in [Brian] Houston’s handling of the scriptures is staggering. It feels as though I could write a book on it.
There are a number of areas where he demonstrates blatant disrespect for the texts he is quoting from. I have highlighted just a few. It is evident that this book has been hacked together with very little thought, not simply based on his exegesis but also on his inconsistent arguments.
It is profoundly disturbing that he is the National President of Assemblies of God in Australia where he has oversight of over 900 churches. Possibly more disturbing is that he is the President of Hills Leadership College where he trains leaders in the discipline of handling the Bible.
He has read into the text what is not there, taken verses out of context, surface read his main proof texts, and disregarded genre and historical setting. He has made a mockery of those who are dedicated to Jesus but live poor and destitute lives because they are under the burden of corrupt governance, famine situations, climatic catastrophes or war.
He is self contradictory and above anything disturbingly shallow.”
From http://definitive.co.nz/essay/houston.pdf
October 5th, 2006 at 9:32 am
Lance,
These guys do play by the rules of orthodoxy. I believe taht thay think God has given them spiritual revelation and a license to interpret the scriptures in any way they see fit - often to their advantage.
They have the cultish mind set, an attitude of ‘entitlement’ and believe that they are Apostles of God, even though their interpretation, teaching and lifestyles are anaethema to the scriptures.
Remember Phil Pringles comment “Jesys told me I no longer need to visit people in prison etc, I have a Church full of People who can do that!”.
Where is that ‘mind set’ supported in the scriptures and exemplified by Jesus?.
October 5th, 2006 at 10:07 am
“These guys do NOT play by the rules of orthodoxy”
October 5th, 2006 at 11:15 am
Lance - that was a good file you found.
With all the pleading for giving to God’s work and to give to God, to tithe to God, for Gods’ purposes, the 7 minute tithing beggings (oops sorry) - sermons etc etc - why are givers encouraged to write a cheque to Hillsong Conference or CCC or whatever [insert name of your church] - what would happen if everyone actually obeyed the principle of giving or tithing to that institution by cheque but writing the cheque out payable to God? (and marked not negotiable) At least that way your conscience would be clear and without guilt as you have tithed to God.
October 5th, 2006 at 2:23 pm
“…..what would happen if everyone actually obeyed the principle of giving or tithing to that institution by cheque but writing the cheque out payable to God? (and marked not negotiable)…”
Good thinking 99.
October 5th, 2006 at 4:30 pm
I’m sure the Church would still Bank it!
I’d still rather place vegetables in the bucket!
October 5th, 2006 at 4:38 pm
I’d rather put a steaming t$$d in the plate these days!
October 5th, 2006 at 9:12 pm
“what would happen if everyone … but writing the cheque out payable to God?”
I counted votes in the SA election in March, and there was was one informal voter who wrote “God” on their lower house ballot paper.
October 8th, 2006 at 1:11 am
A new addition to Hill$ong’s Corporate Governance policy.
http://www2.hillsong.com/church/default.asp?pid=16
“Political Impartiality
Hillsong Church’s objectives are distinct and independent from any political agenda. Hillsong Church does not make financial contributions to or align itself with any political party or candidate.”
October 10th, 2006 at 4:22 pm
Joel Houston signs a bible at the Australian Gospel Music Festival.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joel_Houston
October 12th, 2006 at 9:56 am
and if thats not enough - the Green Belt festival in England (Ithink Darren Wright from Planet Telex has been over to it - perhaps if you read this Darren you could tell us allabout it…I’d love to go over to it one day) has had Brian Houston singing for the crowds
http://www.greenbelt.org.uk/?a=115&pr=77
Just before you reach for the ear plugs…it’s not teh same BH we all lvoe and admire:
October 13th, 2006 at 5:20 pm
Behold, the new Hill$ong.
http://www.roseberyproject.com.au/what_are_we_proposing.html
October 14th, 2006 at 1:06 am
Lance that is so funny!
How much glass is in that?
Do you realise how many hoodlums will be smashing those windows every night?
Just ask Sydney City Toyota about their nice glass windows on the corner of bourke st….haha
I can’t wait
October 15th, 2006 at 1:22 am
“Originally, the old Roads and Traffic Authority site had development consent for 66 townhouses, but Hillsong is trying to change its status after purchasing it in June for $28 million.
Green Square Active has started a petition campaign to fight the project and collected more than 300 signatures in the first few days.”
From http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/3000seat-hillsong-bid-fires-chorus-of-discord/2006/10/14/1160246373307.html
October 15th, 2006 at 4:30 pm
Lance, thanks for the link to the new Hillsong development. Fascinating. I was really interested in their “Summary of community benefits and in principle commitments”:
* Creation of a new park that will be accessible to the public
* Public access to surplus underground car parking on weekdays
* The removal of the unattractive RTA building
* Conferencing/meeting facilities for community and business use
* Provision of a range of community facilities, including a child care centre and a café
* We will request the STA to increase weekend bus services particularly on Sundays
* Quality designed buildings that will improve the visual amenity of a run down site
* Community based uses as opposed to more residential development as proposed under the existing DA
[Source: http://www.roseberyproject.com.au/community_benefits.html ]
I thought this was pretty weak. Community benefits?!! Yeah, right. The new park may be appreciated, and the car parking could be useful (though I doubt it will be a freebie!!), but the rest would seem to be pretty lame.
I’d love to see a list of real community benefits as opposed to this list from Hillsong. What do you think your local community would identify as genuine benefits from a church building project? The Hillsong proposal has made the locals start a petition. What could be done that would instead make the locals say, “Wow!”?
October 15th, 2006 at 7:26 pm
As for being in touch with the local community…..
On Hill$ong’s map of the proposed Rosebery development…the consultants’ development plan shows the new building will be on ‘Rothchild Street’.
http://www.roseberyproject.com.au/what_are_we_proposing.html
The name of the street is Rothschild Avenue.
October 15th, 2006 at 10:17 pm
Darryl, you have got it in one!
Hill$ong cannot come up with any benefits for the community because Hill$ong is fundamentally self serving! They cannot come up with any community benefits except things that may be bi-products of what they already want to do. They could not fathom a single loving act that a normal church would do.
The car park will never be available to the community! At Waterloo they can’t pull the shutter down quick enough to keep out the local filth! This will not change! As if Joel A’Bell or Robert Fergusson or Brain Hoooston or Darlene Cheque want their $100,000 chariots vandalised by the local riff raff.
It is well documented that the local community hate Hill$ong!
And Clover Moore - Mayor of Sydney is not a fan of Hill$ong.
This will be very interesting to watch the millions of $ flow down the drain as the DA bounces around and around.
It is the typical arrogance of Hill$ong to buy a property which is zoned differently to what they want it for!
The child care centre is another example of Hill$ong finding a government funding rort to exploit….
As we all pay Federal Taxes I think I need an explanation from my local member as to why Hill$ong is getting all of these tax benefits (Building programs etc) that are obviously not benefiting the community.
I think I need to ask why are these “Pastors” getting preferential benefits under the FBT legislation that enable them to drive $100,000 motor vehicles.
I think we can all come up with some good questiosn to ask our local members….any suggestions?
October 16th, 2006 at 9:19 am
Here’s something i’d like to understand,
My understasnding about the Pringles & the Hoooooston’s of this world is that they get (ahem!) “callings” to wealthy areas to benefit from the disposable income from the aspirational/professional locals.
What do we know about the socio-demographics of the Rosebery area - what social profile of resident dominates? What are the surrounding suburbs that form the catchment area?
My understanding was that Rosebery was like a blue-collar industrial area? is it not? Will this be an intersting case of a church attempting to gentrify a suburb?
October 16th, 2006 at 10:24 am
Hmmm….according to this Sydney City Council Social profile,
Rosebery has the highest amount of growth in the area of 18-24 year olds in the Sydney City area & also pre-school aged children. Waterloo, where they will have come from is notr of an ageing population.
Maybe it’s not about money so much as stupid young aspirationals?
Scroll to “suburb analysis”
http://72.14.235.104/search?q=cache:ZeVE-6ivSJQJ:www.cityofsydney.nsw.gov.au/Council/documents/policies/SocialPlan2006-2010Volume%25201_FinalJuly06.pdf+Rosebery+Social+Profile&hl=en&gl=au&ct=clnk&cd=2
October 16th, 2006 at 10:25 am
is MORE of an ageing population (waterloo) - was s’posed to say - sorry.
October 16th, 2006 at 5:22 pm
When you are a church that large and wealthy, you look more for things like cost of property and growth demographics. The fact is the people they already have will continue with them. They are looking for a place where their sunday school and young adult groups will do well, and for an inexpensive place where they can manipulate their way through council and secure their dreams for less money.
rev
October 16th, 2006 at 8:34 pm
A couple of things:
#A new survey of consumers by STW Communication Group,”The Australian Report”(Aust Financial report 16.10.06,not available on line unless a subscriber-anyone with a rich capitalist friend who can help?) notes that”…an interest in spirituality is one of the key findings……young people were embracing structural religious groups such as Hillsong because they give them a sense of belonging in a fractured world and as a form of rebellion against their parents.A child who belongs to a Pentecostal christian movement is very disastful and confronting for parents who have actively turned away from religion”.
#Secondly does anyone have any info on whether or not H$$ is represented at the annual feast of tabernacles in Israel “We’re here to represent the Bride of Christ.We’re here just to meet our bridegroom and bless the israeli people because we love them” (ABC Online:Christian Zionists descend on Israel for festival 12.10.06: http://www.abc.net.au/pm/content/2006/s1763733.htm/ ).As you will recall Brian H was there when the Is govt gave land to an evangelical del to build a bible theme park.
October 16th, 2006 at 10:50 pm
HILLSONG VIDEO’S
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AUsMxuzjLSg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nR1fbRMZGzw
October 17th, 2006 at 8:17 pm
alan,
I went to the Feast of Tabernacles as part of a group organised by Ps David Johnston (IICM/CLC Syd) many years ago. I was attending Hills CLC/Hillsong at the time. I’m not sure if the trip was officially endorsed by the church, but the group included a contingent from CLC churches and students from IICM. I don’t know if Hillsong is represented in any way these days.
October 17th, 2006 at 8:30 pm
The book “neo power” by Ross Honeywill and Verity Byth looks at the rising influence of a group they’ve called NEOs (New Economic Order). Find out more here: http://www.neogroup.net/feature_items/neo_books.html
I only bought it yesterday, but it looks like a great read with lots of useful stuff for those of us who are looking to create culturally relevant faith communities. There’s a chapter on religion and spirituality (the first chapter I read in the book - starting at page 199), which includes a brief mention of Hillsong. In the tradition of Lance I thought I’d include the quote here:
“Religion has proven to be a decisive factor in recent presidential elections in the United States, and Islamic fundamentalism is never far from the nightly television news services. And while we see pockets of religious activism in Australia, notably the emergence of the Family First political party and the publicity-rich Hillsong church run by the photogenic Brian and Bobbie Houston, there is no discernable increase in religious activity across the country.
{snip}
Undeniably, the media coverage of politicians visiting the Houstons at Hillsong, the widening debate in the US about the ironically named ‘intelligent design’ or creationism, and the increasing invocation of God in politics around the world demonstrates that God never really left the building - he is back on the well-lit centre stage of noisy minorities.”
And while I’m here, does anyone have any thoughts on comment #860?