hillsongs - the next installment
As the comments in two weeks have gone beyond 500 comments - here is the new thread..
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Signposts is the personal website of Phil and Dan McCredden. We are involved in leadership at Northern Community.
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Recent entries
November 20th, 2006 at 2:27 am
Yeah, she certainly perpetuates her own celebrity. If she was truly uncomfortable, she has the control to step back a little, let the songs just be songs about God. But, her name and image are used to flog the merchandise, and her celebrity is a bankable one for H$.
So even if she wanted to step back a little, would her wishes even be respected, since her stardom brings in big bucks for the Hou$ton family business?
November 20th, 2006 at 10:11 am
Good point Emblazoned…they are both single…
I think I was being a little general there…
My observation is that they love the attention. Especially from women!
November 20th, 2006 at 10:20 am
This is not the face of a woman who is uncomfortable with the celebrity side of things.
http://www.eo.nl/db.images/7309568/image
November 20th, 2006 at 10:30 am
“Neil said: As for all the young guys like JH and Marty etc they love it and lap it up…It is more about picking up women for them from what I could tell.”
Well, Neil, you can’t tell very well.
Marty is engaged. Did you know Neil, that a few years back that all the girls in Hills youth were kept back after a youth meeting and told very specifically that Joel and Marty were off limits? That none of the girls were to approach either in a romantic/relational way unless approached by the guys first?
The reason? Girls were falling all over themselves to be the “chosen brides” and the guys were really distressed by it.
Do your homework. Relay facts, not hearsay.
Lance at least does research before ranting!!!
November 20th, 2006 at 10:38 am
“…..a few years back that all the girls in Hills youth were kept back after a youth meeting and told very specifically that Joel and Marty were off limits? That none of the girls were to approach either in a romantic/relational way unless approached by the guys first?”
That is funny on so many levels.
November 20th, 2006 at 10:40 am
So ..it’s kind of following in the tradition of Brian…who said to his mates when he first saw Bobbie….’I'll have that one there..”
What a guy.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:23 am
Oh ok Dido..obviously personal relationships with the two guys in question doesn’t cut it as facts…ok
November 20th, 2006 at 11:31 am
That off limits thing? That happens to me all the time.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:56 am
Dan, Signposts is not a comedy club…please stick to theological discourse - or bagging out H$ based on hearsay and innuendo - speaking of innuendo, anyone had a colonosopy lately?
November 20th, 2006 at 12:20 pm
Neil, define “personal relationships”.
And saying hi on Sunday doen’t count. I’m assuming then that you are/were in their close circle of friends, not simply an acquaintance?
November 20th, 2006 at 12:33 pm
Dido,
I would not consider myself a close personal friend of MS or JH but your extreme alternative has is certainly not the case.
If you knew anything about Hill$ong you would know that there is no such thing as a “Sunday” relationship. Hill$ong rolls on 24 hours a day 7 days a week!
Your credibility is a little thin with me!
Anyway, having sung with them regularly on weekends and rehearsed with them almost weekly and sat with them through countless vision nights and Maximum Impact Training and worked vocal arrangements with them both and DZ & MW & RM on 2 albums and had several meals with them…I think I am entitled to have an opinion.
If you’re asking, “would I jump in a car and drag a dead possum around behind”? The answer is no, I don’t think I’m that close and personal with them.
Geez! Attitude problem or what?
November 20th, 2006 at 2:37 pm
“So ..it’s kind of following in the tradition of Brian…who said to his mates when he first saw Bobbie….’I’ll have that one there..”
And she was flattered by that??
November 20th, 2006 at 2:40 pm
poor, poor neil.
so touchy today.
it was a simple question neil. Interesting how a lot of people here instantly assume an attack when a question is asked.
nervous bunch aren’t we?
November 20th, 2006 at 2:47 pm
Question, to everyone posting in this forum: what are we trying to achieve here? Not a loaded question at all, I’ve been thinking about it a lot over the weekend and honestly want to know.
Is this supposed to be a forum where we just bitch about other people? Because I don’t think that’s very Christian. What sort of a frigging message would we be showing the rest of the world if that was honestly (or subconsciously) our intention.
Is this supposed to be a forum where we can talk about Christianity, or current issues? I’m loving that part of the site. LF and the rev, you have some great viewpoints that I’m learning a lot from.
Before you post, BEFORE you post: just think about what kind of seed you are trying to sow hey?
Lance I’ve particularly been angry with you over the weekend, having the audacity to imagine a whole church service at a church you haven’t been to, and then ridiculing that church for the things you imagined. If the fruit of this website is supposed to be anger, you’re doing a great job of planting mate.
November 20th, 2006 at 2:54 pm
and if the fruit is supposed to be stupidity…well
November 20th, 2006 at 2:56 pm
FYI
Marty - http://www.myspace.com/martysampson
Joel - http://www.myspace.com/forallthepeople
Michael - http://www.myspace.com/michaelguy
Marcus - http://www.myspace.com/munkey_boy
There’s more but I can’t be bothered.
November 20th, 2006 at 3:30 pm
“Lance I’ve particularly been angry with you over the weekend, having the audacity to imagine a whole church service at a church you haven’t been to, and then ridiculing that church for the things you imagined.”
The stories of real-life people who’ve been to Hill$ong and risen to the dizzy heights of being almost close enough to be able to lick Brian’s bottom …are much …much worse and scary than what I imagined here..
I haven’t been bullied by Brian, or had the harrassing phone calls, or had to hide in a closet to protect myself from Hill$ongers, or been told by Darlene that I shouldn’t need to be ‘babied’…or had to turn to the person next to me and tell them their ‘awesome’…or had the person sitting next to me inspecting my wallet on Brian’s instruction to see whether there’s more that I could ‘tithe’….or had my worship CD’s buried at the Blacktown tip…or had the threatening letter from the Hill$ong lawyers (yet)…and frankly, I don’t want to imagine, let alone experience those aspects of the Hill$ong cult.
I’m surprised that you or anyone with half a brain would want to either.
November 20th, 2006 at 3:30 pm
OKay, tempers seem to be getting a little frayed here. Dido and Neil - I liked your discussion better when it was about the celebrity thing and the way that is managed.
As for your question Foundation, I think it is a good thing to ask and not at all stupid. But if discussion of this question continues, I think it is more likely to be productive if we steer away from the personal stuff (and that is everyone, people!!).
FWIW my own feelings about and critique of what I will call the “contemporary worship church” model, which includes Hillsong have far less to do with what happens in their services (there are plenty of churches whose worship I would not like), but more on the way that the model has impacted on the rest of mainstream christianity in Australia.
November 20th, 2006 at 3:45 pm
Understood Lance, you don’t like what you’ve heard about Hillsong. But what alternative are you offering? It’s either go to Hillsong or sit around googling Hillsong and posting hatred on the internet?
Ah, sorry Dan, sorry.
I’m a ‘first generation Christian’, none of my family are saved yet. I have a habit of looking at things through non-churched eyes and judging what my family would think of Christians if they were to see what I’m seeing. I’m desperate to get my family (all of them) even through the doors of a church, just that far for a start. For myself, I see all this squabbling as something that will only drive the non-churched further from church. And that, in my book, is a bad thing.
November 20th, 2006 at 3:51 pm
Hatred? Nice way with emotive words, but I don’t see hatred in this site. Not hatred for Hill$ong, anyway.
“I have a habit of looking at things through non-churched eyes and judging what my family would think of Christians if they were to see what I’m seeing.”
Exactly - one of my big problems with Hill$ong.
November 20th, 2006 at 3:52 pm
If you go to the myspaces you’ll see me on their friends lists *feels proud*
Agreed foundation. Agreed. But Hillsong chews up people and spits them out. And not just a couple of people…a LOT of people…and that is a real concern.
November 20th, 2006 at 3:58 pm
“I’m a ‘first generation Christian’, none of my family are saved yet. I have a habit of looking at things through non-churched eyes and judging what my family would think of Christians if they were to see what I’m seeing. I’m desperate to get my family (all of them) even through the doors of a church, just that far for a start.”
And you think taking the family to a church like Hill$ong is going to make them take Christianity seriously?
Are you out of your fucking mind?
Sorry to be blunt…but…
Are you out of your fucking mind?
Someone needs to vigorously shake you back to reality…
November 20th, 2006 at 4:00 pm
“But Hillsong chews up people and spits them out. And not just a couple of people…a LOT of people…and that is a real concern.”
AMEN
November 20th, 2006 at 4:08 pm
I mean…..what is wrong with people?
When did being an airhead go mainstream?
When I was a lad …way back in the 20th century….Bill and Ted’s Excellent Adventure was a parody of airheads.
Now it’s something for today’s generation of Christian youth to aspire to.
I read the blogs of Hill$ongers all the time.
They’re all trying to out-airhead each other….
And THIS is the great example..that’s to be set to non-churchgoers to embrace Christianity?
If YOU come from a non-Christian background….YOU Foundation, of all people, should know a whole lot better than to claim a Hill$ong style church is a shining light in an Australian culture that widely regards Hill$ong as ‘those fuckin’ happy-clapper till-on-the-hill cunts’.
November 20th, 2006 at 4:12 pm
If you go to the myspaces you’ll see me on their friends lists *feels proud*
There are thousands of people listed as “friends”!! Fercrynoutloud. Is it just me, or do other people find it hard to understand the whole myspace thing?
November 20th, 2006 at 4:20 pm
“And you think taking the family to a church like Hill$ong is going to make them take Christianity seriously?”
No, you misunderstand me, and maybe I’m not making myself clear. I would be happy for my family to hear the word of God no matter whose mouth it was coming out of.
But that wasn’t the point I was wanting to make.
I’m saying that I imagine them on here reading this website, seeing this nastiness, thinking that all Christians have to do all day is complain about churches they don’t like instead of getting out and spreading the word of God.
“I read the blogs of Hill$ongers all the time.”
Read them and attack them Lance? Copy their blogs here and encourage people to go and post nasty comments on their pages?
I think this is getting heated, like Dan said, which I don’t want. I just want to encourage people to think about the fruit they’re planting with these nasty comments. How about we try to be constructive. So you think Hillsong have been nasty? How about being nice back then? You think Hillsong chew people up and spit them out? How about you start trying to love people then? Otherwise I can’t see how you could think that you are any better than what you are professing to hate.
November 20th, 2006 at 4:25 pm
My space - don’t get it. MySpace - meet people - NO NO NO go out to the club or the disco or teh beqach and meet people - MySpace? My“too much”Space“between the ears”
November 20th, 2006 at 4:26 pm
disco or the beach and meet people
November 20th, 2006 at 4:34 pm
I’m with you Greg, maybe I’m getting old but I can’t understand myspace at all. The whole layout confuses me. I try to check out my friends sites but can never figure them out.
Maybe it’s like those ringtones that you can get that only kids can hear, did you hear about those? Apparently it’s at a high pitch, and as you get older you lose that top end of your hearing.
November 20th, 2006 at 4:35 pm
“No, you misunderstand me, and maybe I’m not making myself clear.”
No, you’re being perfectly clear.
You want Christians to lie, and pretend that nobody has any problem with what anybody is doing, and therefore, as a whole…you want the Christian community to lie to the outside world about what really goes on.
I can’t lie any longer.
I can’t tell people to go to church when I know their head is going to be messed with.
You might be able to still do that.
I can’t do that.