hillsongs - the next installment
As the comments in two weeks have gone beyond 500 comments - here is the new thread..
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Signposts is the personal website of Phil and Dan McCredden. We are involved in leadership at Northern Community.
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Recent entries
February 2nd, 2007 at 10:30 pm
jack
Ripper, fact is, thankfully I’m way past just hanging in there after spending the last 4 years expunging HS doctrine from my Christianity, the bible has been the key for me as I’ve gone thru and reread things I was mislead about and rediscovered truths I learned when I first believed. It’s actually simple to be a Christian I reckon, not complicated like they make it.
February 2nd, 2007 at 10:41 pm
“It’s actually simple to be a Christian I reckon, not complicated like they make it.”
Never a truer statement has been made on signposts!
February 2nd, 2007 at 10:44 pm
Spiro
Glad to hear it mate. Me too finally!
BTW if I wasn’t using the same (old faithful) bible I would swear that someone has messed with the content over the past few years!! It looks the same but reads different!
I guess the same could be said of me! “Looks the same … but reads different.”
Jack
February 2nd, 2007 at 10:52 pm
1648
Greg the explorer Says:
February 2nd, 2007 at 9:15 pm
Anais - excellent call - your last post here has saved you from looking like an absolute arse- and now I look like a patronising git
– I don’t think you do in the slightest, so no worries there
February 2nd, 2007 at 10:54 pm
Someone put in a link to http://www.god.tv a few days ago and I’ve has a few looks at the different programs. Bobbie Houston is on there right now. It’s the first time I’ve ever seen or heard her in action - what a ridiculous and shallow woman.
February 2nd, 2007 at 11:25 pm
simmo
Welcome to the world of the incredibly spiritual funky HS female role model !
This is a form invented many moons ago by the famous Yana Drama Kharma, the erstwhile Youth Pastor. It is a melange of all the ‘Friends’ sitcom characters.
February 3rd, 2007 at 6:45 am
I have nothing else to do today, funny reading Zulus drum story over at Fleecing, Bristlin’ Bob always fancied himself as a drummer (please forgive my nicknames, it’s my private sad humour), one day he was showing off on stage and disappeared down the back of the riser, everyone looked around to see where he’d gone and he had totally disappeared. there was one neat time when BB’s anally retentive mate from Seattle (?) was there, I call him Kid Billy, he was the one who made a mil out of the destiny thing, the one who got banned from NZ for saying Jesus was rich….man you couldn’t make this stuff up ! He also thought he was a good drummer and displaced the real guy one night and began slowing the song down. Mellow Mountain Man (let’s play a game…you figure out who I’m talking about and you win a free subscription to godtv.) who was leading at the time got really miffed and sachayed over to tell him to piss off while the band played on. MMM was the only guy who chastised Kid Billy and lived to fight another day. ‘Course there was the priceless moment when Bob tried to bully the drummer into playing a solo during the service. This particular drummer was a no shit Aussie and refused thus creating an embarrassing standoff and Bristlin’s bravery suddenly turned into a foot shuffling dangerous moment. He was only let off the hook by the drummer’s 3 hit wonder, like the tired punchline of a music hall gag.
Oh the joy of it all, memories, like the corners of my mind…tra la la
February 3rd, 2007 at 10:59 am
“(let’s play a game…you figure out who I’m talking about and you win a free subscription to godtv.) ”
Ohh gooody - send it on over as I know all the players above!
Mind you, mellow mountain man should really be “politicing, behind -the-scenes-manipulating, back stabbing” mellow mountain man!
oh the good old days…
February 3rd, 2007 at 11:48 am
“Being CATHOLIC, THE ’70s meant rock masses, liturgical dancing and clapping to Rock My Soul in the Bosom of Abraham until you lost all will to live. When you heard the word “priest” you didn’t immediately think “child molester” - you thought of that guy with sideburns and shocking breath who played the guitar badly and wanted to be “down with the youth”. Or alternatively an old Irish bloke with dandruff who wanted to be “down at the pub”.
Our family went to church every Sunday unless the car wouldn’t start and in that case we’d watch Mass for You at Home: just as soul-destroying and mind-numbing as the real thing, but it took half the time and you didn’t have to shake hands with that weird guy with the eczema.
Thirty years later and Mass for You at Home is still on, at the convenient time of 6am on Sunday. Which is great for all those breastfeeding mothers, ravers pulling a few bongs to chill out after dance parties and people like you and I who are bang up for a bit of crack-of-dawn Catholicism.
Sure, it hasn’t won any Logies, but it’s a stayer and you’ve got to give it that.
I watched it the other day and Father Greg Bennet was hosting. I couldn’t help wondering if other priests slag him off along the lines of: “He’s changed. Oh yes, he is so up himself now with his fancy TV job. I’d have ‘em slayed in the spirit, speaking in tongues and gagging for more. Not that I’d lower myself. Has he sold out or what?”
It’s a half hour of unanimated, soporific comfort that says: “You either have faith or you don’t and we are not going to tart it up with any of Satan’s glamour to please you heathens.”
I can’t work out if it’s a celebration, a ritual or an endurance. The dutiful congregation drones the responses and it gets laid-back at the end as the handful of true believers hang out chatting with Father as the credits roll. It’s fine. For what it is. Which is church on television. If that’s what rings your bells.
But if you want to rage for Jesus, hang out until 6.30am and it’s rockin’, prayin’, lovin’, singin’ and praisin’ with Hillsong. If you want your Christianity pumpin’ and jumpin’, hold on to your crucifix and leave all that losin’, hurtin’, cryin’ and fightin’ behind. Strap yourself in to hear the words “potential” and “awesome” a lot. Be a winner for Jesus!
Hillsong looks like a video clip with its fast editing, funky graphics and rock’n'roll just the way the Lord would like it. Pastor Brian Houston whips his massive congregation into a frenzy about how to tackle poverty. Yes that’s right, the same Pastor Brian Houston who wrote the book You Need More Money. Because what would Jesus buy?
Spirituality is a beautiful thing when it inspires people to choose love over fear, truth over deception and people over possessions. I just get cynical when I get a whiff of religion-approved racism, religion-authorised sexism or religion-promoted greed. Or Kumbaya.”
From http://www.theage.com.au/news/tv–radio/praise-be-sunday-morning-tv/2007/01/31/1169919396208.html
February 3rd, 2007 at 7:09 pm
“politicing, behind -the-scenes-manipulating, back stabbing” mellow mountain man!
Ah, so you might also know who Priness Francesca is, MMM’s off sider, no not that one, the singing one, also the other two of the 5star gang..Kid Billy, Oneshot Wyatt and Hippitee. For W think mono brow and mass abuse, for H think world domination. For all of them think…towels must be kept at 23degrees.
I’m sorry if you didn’t get my subtle sarcasm in Mellows title, yours is much more to the point…..very funny
February 3rd, 2007 at 9:34 pm
I heard something in the press about 2 weeks ago about an ex-Hillsong member writing a book about her experiences there. I’m sure the Sydney Morning Herald mentioned it somewhere. Anyone know anything about this?
February 4th, 2007 at 8:38 am
Re 1661: That will be Tanya - Lionfish has the release details I think
February 4th, 2007 at 2:49 pm
Thanks Jane. Lionfish, any news on the release of her book?
February 4th, 2007 at 5:26 pm
Last I heard, sometime in May
February 4th, 2007 at 5:42 pm
I believe Tanya’s Book is due in May “People in Glass Houses” … it will be interesting because from what I have seen - the publisher has no fear labelling Hillsong a cult. (They must have got the legal OK to do so!).
Anyway, If May still seems like a long wait, the documentary “Suffer The Children” premieres in February. It is a bowling for Colombine styled expose into the speaking circuit and hoe the money flows from the dodgy teaching on tithing to the Pastors own tax exempt “charity” (err, family trust).
This will be interesting, and I am hoping to interview the Producer just for Signposts.
February 4th, 2007 at 7:14 pm
1665
You can guarantee that when the book is published ( depending on what it says) the seige mentality will kick in again at HS and they will be saying it’s an attack of the devil, that’s how they always turn the congregation inward instead of facing the issues. It’s happened a thousand times.
Acts 17:11
‘I consider myself to be an anti-Pentacostal Pentacostal. By that I mean that I cannot stand many of the trappings of the modern Pentacostal church. My style of worship and relationship with the Father would fall under the Pentacostal model- I speak in tongues, I raise my hands in worship, I believe that Jesus bore all of my sin, sickness and disease on the cross and I experience the manifest presence of God, His Holy Spirit in my life.’
just be thankful that you don’t go to HS because even that wouldn’t be enough for you to be a christian you’d have to bluddy jump all thru the ‘music’ too in order to prove you have deep joy. Plus you’d have to find which strand of hand raising pattern to fit into. Depending on sex and age, are you a hand inward or outward ?, arms to the side and back like a virginal silver lady ? or arms forward ? or fists clenched like a young turk or a plaintif alms for the poor slightly upraised cup? or do you hold on to your blackberry and raise it to Jesus ? decisions decisions !
February 4th, 2007 at 8:29 pm
Lionfish, is the doco just about Hill$ong or about preachers in general? Also, do you know where the doco is being shown- free to air or cable? Can’t wait to hear from that producer too
February 4th, 2007 at 9:24 pm
The Producer was raisied in a ‘WorldwideChurch of God*’ (Ammstrongism) cult (they tithed the full 30%) … then became an AOG (tithed 10%). He is an astute businessman and looked into the ‘mechanics’ of the machine after seeing some ‘dodgy theology’ and his Church give away a car to another Pastor … and he came up with the same conclusions that I (we all) have.
He sold a Business that he owned and used his own money to hire a professional film crew to travel all over the world. I believe he wants the documentary distributed for free.
He has aslo interviewed an number of ‘SignPosters’ … (for the record, I could not make it but only spoke to him over the phone at length). He seems to a have a great ’sense of humour’ and he had a few ’stunts’planned.
A contact sent this email recently:
If he plays the ball and not the man (men and women), and the overall tone is positive (which I am sure it will be) then it will create some momentum.
(Note: *The Worldwide Church of God have come into the Orthodox fold and no longer preach Tithing at all). A courageuos move!
February 4th, 2007 at 9:31 pm
Acts 17:11,
BTW … I understand he was in Australia at the same time as the last Hillsong conference was being held!
February 4th, 2007 at 9:45 pm
Thanks Lionfish. Let’s hope it gets an wide Australian release instead of obscure arthouse cinemas
February 4th, 2007 at 9:47 pm
Has anyone had any experience of the Hillsong cloning in Baptist Churches .. complete with preachers with a NZ twang ?
Quite a few rumblings around about Baptist churches in north/northwest Sydney going over to the “dark side” …..
February 4th, 2007 at 10:09 pm
“Has anyone had any experience of the Hillsong cloning in Baptist Churches..”
Yes.
I think we need to pray for Mark and his congregation before they become part of the ‘darkside’ for all eternity!
http://www.marked35.blogspot.com/
February 5th, 2007 at 8:34 am
Re The Documentary “Suffer The Children”.
The Producer has informed me “It will be shown at film festivals and we’ll try and pick up a distributer from there”.
February 5th, 2007 at 2:48 pm
Oh no, they are starting to describe Chris Pringle as the “First Lady” - it has begun.
http://www.ccc.org.au/presence/
And ummm…….can it be true that the most recent National Church Life Survey has stated that CCC is this countries fastest growing church? Wonder what Brian would say about that?
February 5th, 2007 at 3:45 pm
Dr? Pringle - what a wank!
February 5th, 2007 at 5:48 pm
More from CCC, Franscis of Assisi would jump from his grave. How more out of context could this be!
Phenomena 2006 we were ‘Unashamed’…
Now get ready because in 2007 we are getting LOUD!!! St. Francis of Assisi once said: “Preach the gospel at all times, and when necessary use words.”
At Phenomena 2007 we will be living LOUD!. Don’t just hear my words, hear my life… Let’s make our lives LOUD in everything we do for Jesus! Living LOUD is what Jesus has called us to do. You don’t want to miss Phenomena 2007 LOUD, register now!
See you then.
Bless ya,
February 5th, 2007 at 6:33 pm
LOL… that’s awesome. This is the second Phenomena that I will be missing. Although, it actually makes me really sad, that they talk the talk but don’t walk the walk. Of course, I’m not perfect in the slightest sense of the word, but I know that Jesus works through me to touch others that don’t know him, even if I don’t bring a new friends to church every week (or at all).
Reve, they’ve been calling her the first lady of CCC for quite some time now… probably a couple of years. And Phil has been a Dr. the last few years as well.
February 5th, 2007 at 7:01 pm
What is he a doctor of?
February 5th, 2007 at 7:17 pm
janet
He’s a doctor of style over substance.
February 5th, 2007 at 8:27 pm
“What is he a doctor of?”
I emailed CCC a couple of weeks ago..to ask where Phil Pringle got his ‘Doctorate of Biblical Philosophy’.
No answer from Oxford Falls, so I’ll follow it up by phone.
Also, CCC’s Sunday morning combined service video (featuring Bronwyn Bishop) is yet to be posted on their website.
Can’t wait for that one.
Past experience shows the video can be posted on their site as late as Wednesday or Thursday (although the 6PM service was up on the site early yesterday).