Comments on: churches of christ social justice network blog http://www.signposts.org.au/2006/08/01/churches-of-christ-social-justice-network-blog/ musings from those on the journey Thu, 08 Jan 2009 23:19:05 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.3.3 By: Lionfish http://www.signposts.org.au/2006/08/01/churches-of-christ-social-justice-network-blog/#comment-144253 Lionfish Thu, 03 Aug 2006 17:04:56 +0000 http://www.signposts.org.au/2006/08/01/churches-of-christ-social-justice-network-blog/#comment-144253 <em> "Those bloody men get the blame for everything…"</em> And they damned well should. Losers. :-) “Those bloody men get the blame for everything…”

And they damned well should. Losers. :-)

]]> By: dan http://www.signposts.org.au/2006/08/01/churches-of-christ-social-justice-network-blog/#comment-144250 dan Thu, 03 Aug 2006 13:14:20 +0000 http://www.signposts.org.au/2006/08/01/churches-of-christ-social-justice-network-blog/#comment-144250 <i> “Evil Prevails when good men do nothing”.</i> Those bloody men get the blame for everything.... Alan, I agree with most of your points. Our comments policy here (for better or worse) is evidence of our views on this stuff. But we have certain freedoms that others don't. FWIW I am glad that there are "safer" places around on the net than signposts also discussing these things - because some people need that in order to engage in the discussion. “Evil Prevails when good men do nothing”.

Those bloody men get the blame for everything….

Alan, I agree with most of your points. Our comments policy here (for better or worse) is evidence of our views on this stuff. But we have certain freedoms that others don’t. FWIW I am glad that there are “safer” places around on the net than signposts also discussing these things - because some people need that in order to engage in the discussion.

]]> By: Lionfish http://www.signposts.org.au/2006/08/01/churches-of-christ-social-justice-network-blog/#comment-144246 Lionfish Thu, 03 Aug 2006 12:24:04 +0000 http://www.signposts.org.au/2006/08/01/churches-of-christ-social-justice-network-blog/#comment-144246 "Here I stand, I can do no other" - martin Luther All I can say is 'Thank God' for 'SignPosts'- allowing people to communicate and share openly. The CoC Pastor is now using 'Christian Restraint' as an excuse for his rationale for evryone playing "nicley", and not speaking out. This is a cop-out. I have a well researched book published in (circa 1971) where a journalist investigated the Contemporary (Hi-Fi) Church movement. It is called "Praise the Lord and Pass the Contribution" by Alan Bestic. The exact same things regarding profuteering from faith, the religious trade, spiritual maniupluation that were happening then - are still happening now... Why...? 1) Lack of easy access to information (ie. internet) 2) Lack of courage of mainsteam Church Leaders to speak out, ask questions and name people and organisations. Atleast the Internet is changing things. Pesonally I thank God for people like Lance- for rattling me from my spiritual/psychological slumber and getting me to think about things. No thanks to these 'restarined' mainstream Church pastors. <em> "Evil Prevails when good men do nothing". </em> “Here I stand, I can do no other” - martin Luther

All I can say is ‘Thank God’ for ‘SignPosts’- allowing people to communicate and share openly.

The CoC Pastor is now using ‘Christian Restraint’ as an excuse for his rationale for evryone playing “nicley”, and not speaking out.

This is a cop-out.

I have a well researched book published in (circa 1971) where a journalist investigated the Contemporary (Hi-Fi) Church movement. It is called “Praise the Lord and Pass the Contribution” by Alan Bestic.

The exact same things regarding profuteering from faith, the religious trade, spiritual maniupluation that were happening then - are still happening now…

Why…?

1) Lack of easy access to information (ie. internet)
2) Lack of courage of mainsteam Church Leaders to speak out, ask questions and name people and organisations.

Atleast the Internet is changing things.

Pesonally I thank God for people like Lance- for rattling me from my spiritual/psychological slumber and getting me to think about things. No thanks to these ‘restarined’ mainstream Church pastors.

“Evil Prevails when good men do nothing”.

]]> By: alan http://www.signposts.org.au/2006/08/01/churches-of-christ-social-justice-network-blog/#comment-144240 alan Thu, 03 Aug 2006 11:41:55 +0000 http://www.signposts.org.au/2006/08/01/churches-of-christ-social-justice-network-blog/#comment-144240 Dan I dont have a problem with the blog owner having right/responsibilit/ or belief to do what they like with their blog. But censorship is always a problem;if the issue is swearing/language - is "bloody"in,and "bugger" out or is it the other way about!Is blasphemy in (god gave israel their land therefore its ok to bomb,blast and burn anyone else), or out. Its fequently easier and more convenient to get ones knickers in a knot about language than to respond to the content of whats being said. Much of the comment on churches on this blog as I've followed it - whether or not AOG,Hillsong,Syd anglicans,orwillow creek( i dont quite understand hamos position either)etc arise out of people's experience,research or the state of their liver. Whats the problem with exposing/confronting the penis theology of a jensen or the brutality of a houston or the money grubbing of a joyce m?Just an extension of tossing the market out of the temple isnt it? What is interesting in this thread, is that this is the first time that CofC have been the subject of any kind of a critique (swearing or not).Like the AOG,the willow creek mob etc they also lack checks and balances in their governance compared to other "heritage" (must say have never heard the owrd before so hope I know what itmeans)churches.Its therefore not surprising that staff and officers of CofC will be concerned about a blog or anything that is not "under control" I dont have too many worries about language, what would worry me would be any attempt to direct/control/censor the "content" of the discussion. I know that this is not where you're moving and for my part appreciate the opportunity to participate in the issues which are tossed about, without too many restrictions. Dan I dont have a problem with the blog owner having right/responsibilit/ or belief to do what they like with their blog. But censorship is always a problem;if the issue is swearing/language - is “bloody”in,and “bugger” out or is it the other way about!Is blasphemy in (god gave israel their land therefore its ok to bomb,blast and burn anyone else), or out.
Its fequently easier and more convenient to get ones knickers in a knot about language than to respond to the content of whats being said.
Much of the comment on churches on this blog as I’ve followed it - whether or not AOG,Hillsong,Syd anglicans,orwillow creek( i dont quite understand hamos position either)etc arise out of people’s experience,research or the state of their liver.
Whats the problem with exposing/confronting the penis theology of a jensen or the brutality of a houston or the money grubbing of a joyce m?Just an extension of tossing the market out of the temple isnt it?
What is interesting in this thread, is that this is the first time that CofC have been the subject of any kind of a critique (swearing or not).Like the AOG,the willow creek mob etc they also lack checks and balances in their governance compared to other “heritage” (must say have never heard the owrd before so hope I know what itmeans)churches.Its therefore not surprising that staff and officers of CofC will be concerned about a blog or anything that is not “under control”
I dont have too many worries about language, what would worry me would be any attempt to direct/control/censor the “content” of the discussion. I know that this is not where you’re moving and for my part appreciate the opportunity to participate in the issues which are tossed about, without too many restrictions.

]]> By: dan http://www.signposts.org.au/2006/08/01/churches-of-christ-social-justice-network-blog/#comment-144228 dan Thu, 03 Aug 2006 07:29:00 +0000 http://www.signposts.org.au/2006/08/01/churches-of-christ-social-justice-network-blog/#comment-144228 Lance, but the fact is that news.com.au has the power and the right to determine what they will and will not publish, whether it be by way of feedback or not. And as long as they have a policy and implement it consistently I don't see a problem. Now, that is not to say that you can't disagree and say that you would run your site differently. And overall, I think that moderation used for the purpose of stifling criticism or whatever is facile. As you have pointed out plenty of times Lance, many churches in the F2F world rely on written or unwritten rules requiring behaviour to be within certain boundaries. In fact, many people consider that allowing behaviour which is outside those boundaries is in fact unChristian. So it should be no surprise that people carry over those real world expectations to the online world. Lance, but the fact is that news.com.au has the power and the right to determine what they will and will not publish, whether it be by way of feedback or not. And as long as they have a policy and implement it consistently I don’t see a problem.

Now, that is not to say that you can’t disagree and say that you would run your site differently. And overall, I think that moderation used for the purpose of stifling criticism or whatever is facile.

As you have pointed out plenty of times Lance, many churches in the F2F world rely on written or unwritten rules requiring behaviour to be within certain boundaries. In fact, many people consider that allowing behaviour which is outside those boundaries is in fact unChristian. So it should be no surprise that people carry over those real world expectations to the online world.

]]> By: Greg the explorer http://www.signposts.org.au/2006/08/01/churches-of-christ-social-justice-network-blog/#comment-144223 Greg the explorer Thu, 03 Aug 2006 06:45:54 +0000 http://www.signposts.org.au/2006/08/01/churches-of-christ-social-justice-network-blog/#comment-144223 Oh my goodness...Dan and Phil believe that all trolls are gay!!! I'm telling mike at chat2gether, he'll konw what to get me to say. Oh my goodness…Dan and Phil believe that all trolls are gay!!!

I’m telling mike at chat2gether, he’ll konw what to get me to say.

]]> By: Lance http://www.signposts.org.au/2006/08/01/churches-of-christ-social-justice-network-blog/#comment-144221 Lance Thu, 03 Aug 2006 06:25:25 +0000 http://www.signposts.org.au/2006/08/01/churches-of-christ-social-justice-network-blog/#comment-144221 So...if 'Harry from Innaloo' posts a response at the news.com.au website ...solemnly declaring 'all tadpoles come in chocolate, strawberry and rum & raisin' in response to an article about underworld crime in Melbourne....then news.com.au readers automatically think....'OMG....Rupert Murdoch believes all tadpoles come in chocolate, strawberry and rum & raisin...I can't believe Rupert and his News Limited subsidiaries believe that......what an irresponsible view for Rupert and News Limited to take...'? Ummmm...I think your average reader ..even a brain-dead Christian.... can tell the difference between a 'normal churchgoer' and a gay troll like me...... So…if ‘Harry from Innaloo’ posts a response at the news.com.au website …solemnly declaring ‘all tadpoles come in chocolate, strawberry and rum & raisin’ in response to an article about underworld crime in Melbourne….then news.com.au readers automatically think….’OMG….Rupert Murdoch believes all tadpoles come in chocolate, strawberry and rum & raisin…I can’t believe Rupert and his News Limited subsidiaries believe that……what an irresponsible view for Rupert and News Limited to take…’?

Ummmm…I think your average reader ..even a brain-dead Christian…. can tell the difference between a ‘normal churchgoer’ and a gay troll like me……

]]> By: Janet http://www.signposts.org.au/2006/08/01/churches-of-christ-social-justice-network-blog/#comment-144219 Janet Thu, 03 Aug 2006 06:18:04 +0000 http://www.signposts.org.au/2006/08/01/churches-of-christ-social-justice-network-blog/#comment-144219 Thanks Dan... your comment is helpful. It behoves (my lecturer uses that word so I like to pinch it) organisations which sponsor blogs to place somewhere boldly that the comments posted may not be the official view of the organisation. Still... the capacity of others not to read these things can be remarkable... hence the choice to "moderate content". Thanks Dan… your comment is helpful. It behoves (my lecturer uses that word so I like to pinch it) organisations which sponsor blogs to place somewhere boldly that the comments posted may not be the official view of the organisation.

Still… the capacity of others not to read these things can be remarkable… hence the choice to “moderate content”.

]]> By: Greg the explorer http://www.signposts.org.au/2006/08/01/churches-of-christ-social-justice-network-blog/#comment-144217 Greg the explorer Thu, 03 Aug 2006 06:12:58 +0000 http://www.signposts.org.au/2006/08/01/churches-of-christ-social-justice-network-blog/#comment-144217 stop it Lance stop it - your words can be so cruel sometimes. I've been partying onwith Hamo and his friends over his back down - I just don;t get it - his origianl post wasn;'t rued -just str8 talking - and yet he feels he needs to apologise for causing offence to people who are ripping otrher folks off - am I crazy or as Hamo says do i just not get the point? stop it Lance stop it - your words can be so cruel sometimes.

I’ve been partying onwith Hamo and his friends over his back down - I just don;t get it - his origianl post wasn;’t rued -just str8 talking - and yet he feels he needs to apologise for causing offence to people who are ripping otrher folks off - am I crazy or as Hamo says do i just not get the point?

]]> By: Lance http://www.signposts.org.au/2006/08/01/churches-of-christ-social-justice-network-blog/#comment-144216 Lance Thu, 03 Aug 2006 06:00:33 +0000 http://www.signposts.org.au/2006/08/01/churches-of-christ-social-justice-network-blog/#comment-144216 Bullshit. Bullshit.

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