Driscoll on Prosperity and Poverty Theology
I am not a fawning Mark Driscoll (Mars Hill founder) fan, however I did appreciate this comment from his blog and also picked up in ‘The Seattle Times’, highlighting the differences and similarities between Prosperity Theology and Poverty Theology:
“When it comes to the issue of rich and poor there is a great theological debate. On one side is Prosperity Theology which essentially says that if you are a holy person with enough faith you will drive an Escalade with rims in Jesus’ name. But what appears to be even more popular among younger missionally minded Christians is an overreaction to Prosperity Theology, called Poverty Theology, where if you really love Jesus you will live very minimally because, like Bono, you believe that Jesus loves the poor, likely more than the rich.
The problem with both Prosperity Theology and Poverty Theology is that they are both half right and both half wrong. What they share is that they are both wrong to make money the issue. The real issue is not money, but righteousness”.
Driscoll Categorises people into one of four Groups:
| Category #1 Righteous Rich People who become rich because God has blessed them, they have worked hard, invested smart, and have not obtained wealth through sin. These people also spend their money righteously through tithing, sharing, caring for the needy, etc. Examples include Abraham, Job after he was restored, and Joseph of Aramathea. |
Category #3 The Unrighteous Rich People who become rich through sin and spend their money in a sinful way. Examples include Pharaoh, Judas Iscariot, and the rich young ruler. |
| Category #2 Righteous Poor People who are poor because they are righteous, are righteous despite being poor, and act righteously with their money though they are poor. Examples include Jesus, the widow who gave her mite, and orphaned children. |
Category #4 The Unrighteous Poor People who have no money because they do not work, do not spend wisely, and do not tithe to God. Proverbs speaks a lot about sluggards and about people not eating if they won’t work, and Paul says that any man who does not provide for his family has denied his faith and is worse than an unbeliever. |
Source: http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/faithvalues/2003112927_driscoll08.html
Source 2: http://theresurgence.com/brother_bono
Would love to know you people’s take (and especially the Rev’s) take on this. I think it makes some degree of sense.
(And yes, Kevin, Category #1 mentions tithing. It depends on the way it is taught (compulsion or tradition). I would personally amend this to read ‘Regular proportionate giving, as God has placed on one’s heart!).
November 9th, 2006 at 4:30 am
which brings up another question, if your wife has a tool in her pants does that make her your husband?
rev
November 15th, 2006 at 12:36 am
“After standing by while Misogynist Mark beats up on women regularly, it is time for us to stand up for the oppressed. People Against Fundamentalism is sickened by the injustice preached from the Mars Hill pulpit. We are done standing by while Mark the Misogynist takes his misguided religion and hollows out the humanity, dignity, and equality of the women in our midst.
So, we’re organizing our first direct action. On Sunday, December 3, we’re going to take a physical stand against injustice outside the Mars Hill Ballard Campus in Seattle at the 11am service.
We’ve no idea if Mark the Misogynist is going to be there. We are not seeking an explosive confrontation or a shouting match. We simply want to show Mars Hill congregants and the rest of Seattle that we will no longer tolerate Driscoll’s view of women.”
From http://www.endfundamentalism.org/20061111/take-action-on-nov-19-mark-the-misogynist-and-mars-hill/
November 16th, 2006 at 11:23 am
Thanks Rev … you have just managed to mess with my head!
Wayne said: (Post 74)
“Rev I have appreciated your radical (at least radical in our consumeristic society) stand that you take, and have appreciated your thought process and passionate desire to follow Jesus. This is all very timely for me as I am in a place of trying to reconsider my working and financial future after finishing up as a pastor”.
Wayne could have written that sentence with ME in mind! Although for the sake of clarification I am involved in a leadership position (of sorts) with a small group of Home Churches (which my wife and I pioneered in December last year; and which contains a number of ex pastors) I would no longer see myself as a pastor – another story for another time, perhaps.
And perhaps like Wayne, (I don’t know him personally so I’ll stick to my own story) I was recently released (by God) from the ‘Assemblies OR God’ institution here in NSW. I had been a prisoner (institutionalised) for nearly two decades and had worked my way up to a sort of trusteeship in charge of a few groups of fellow prisoners.
Anyway much to my dismay, when I was released I began an unexpected but terrifying experience - which some here have identified as ‘detoxing from the church’! The truth is; while I am out of the institution; as yet, the institution is not out of me! But I digress.
When we began the Home Churches almost a year ago, I thought at the time that I knew what I was doing!? However, as the months passed and we became more radical (‘only do what the Father is saying’ kinda stuff … I mean who added all that extra stuff in the Bible … or was it always there …hmmm?) then it became obvious to me that I really had no idea – ouch!
Bible College didn’t prepare me for this! Being a Senior Pastor for many, many years didn’t prepare me for this! Considerable experience in Missions overseas and at home didn’t prepare me for this! I felt then, and still do, like an absolute dill! A little hard to take at first when one considers all the years spent at TAFE and Uni and the management roles in the secular world etc.
As if things were not confusing enough … along comes ‘Rev’ with his view on the ‘kingdom of God’!
I am not (at the moment) able to clearly articulate my position; that would require using my brain and it’s still a little fuzzy! But … much to my surprise after an initial (more general) statement by the Rev, followed by my initial ‘what the…?’ I actually found myself resonating to this teaching. And to that end would like to hear more on the subject.
Rev do you deal with this issue in any detail on your blog (I just realised that you had one), if so then perhaps that’s the appropriate place for me to ask questions etc?
BTW Homer or whatever you call yourself, you’re definitely not welcome!
December 5th, 2006 at 9:35 pm
“Several people attending Sunday services voiced support for Driscoll’s philosophy on women’s roles, though church officials had advised them against talking to reporters.
A half-dozen security guards were posted at the Ballard church and a video camera was aimed at the protesters from the building roof. ”
From http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/294572_marshill04.html
December 5th, 2006 at 10:50 pm
“I was recently released (by God) from the ‘Assemblies OR God’ institution”…
LOL!