All good things…
When we first started this site way back in February 2003, we never imagined the way that it would morph and develop to ultimately become what it is today. What started out as a means for us to share and workshop some of our writing has turned into a site focussed much more around a community of people. It has certainly been illuminating.
But four and a half years is a long time. In that time our RL profiles have changed, and to be honest, Phil and I have both lost a sense of energy for this blog (something that would not come as a surprise to regular commenters, who have become accustomed to the fact that we aren’t around as much as we once were). That energy includes monitoring comments, responding to inquiries and requests to change/delete references, and so on.
We have spent several months now discussing what we would do with or about this site. This is what we have come up with. We recognise that the people who comment here have become a community of sorts and we want to give every opportunity for that to continue in some form. We toyed with allowing someone else to take over this site entirely. However, we want to maintain our existing archive as it is a bit of a scrapbook for us. And therefore relinquishing control over signposts isn’t something that we are comfortable with.
So for now we propose to just close the site. The content will remain but we will close the comments on all posts. Closing comments will be a bit of a lengthy process and will commence in the next couple of weeks, starting from the oldest posts. It is possible that in future we will start something new at this site. We might even get six months down the track, decide that we can’t bear to be without this blog and bring it back up - we don’t think so though.
We encourage commenters and others who might wish to maintain the “signposts community” to make some plans in the comments of this thread. It might be starting a group blog or a forum which reflects the same sort of open conversation which takes place here. We are happy to assist in whatever way we can, including directing future visitors to whereever you want.
We will publish a “last post” when we come to finally close off all of the comments, but for now we just wanted to thank our readers and commenters for the last 4 and a half years. To those that have helped with guest posting, and to those that have engaged in conversation and have in some way had their thinking or questioning as a result of this site, we thank you.
August 14th, 2007 at 11:28 am
Thanks for running the only unbiased and open forum that I have known of in the Christian blogosphere. Murdoch owns it all now!
August 14th, 2007 at 12:10 pm
LF,
‘Signpostsnomore … thank God you obly posted (I cannt use the word “contributed”) one comment to this Blog … unless of course you were posting as Facelift, SIlentBob or the like.’
Nope, not me. But what do you mean by ‘the like? Someone who disagrees with you, or Lance?
I too, applaud the openness of this blog. I applaud the right to have ago at someone like Lance for being foul-mouthed about simply being Pentecostal, and in particular at individuals for having a different view of things, and his right to ignore me and slag me with foul language anyway, but, then I appreciate that that is just what everyone is saying, we had a right, on this blog, to say what we thought, and, incidentally, I still have no personal hatred of Lance, and would defend his right to have an opinion anyway, and love him as a brother in Christ, even if we disagree about stuff in a disagreeable manner.
I think I might have warned about actionable comments on one occasion, but not as a threat, more as a warning, because blog-runners, I think, will need to be more circumspect in the future about when and how they level accusations.
August 14th, 2007 at 12:10 pm
Nup, I didn’t miss the point turtleneck. I just think it’s an appalling analogy.
I’m not offended either. Your statement doesn’t personally offend me because I’m fortunate to not be one of the very many Australian women who’s suffered sexual abuse (last stats I saw were suggesting that it was 1/4). I think that anyone who’s been abused as a child might take offence at your comparison, and I’d fully understand that!!
August 14th, 2007 at 1:32 pm
If Signposts Mk II (”Signposts Reloaded”?) moves to forum style software, you might want to look at Vanilla forums. It feels a lot more like a discussion/blog in style, rather than the forum style. Funnily enough, I really don’t like Vanilla for forums (although most forums I read are of a more technical nature), but a lot of people do, and I can see how it would lend itself quite well to a Signposts style site.
http://getvanilla.com/
It does need the RSS feed and Mark All Read add-ons as a minimum though!
If more standard forum software is preferred, vBulletin is about the best IMO, or if you prefer freely available open source, Simple Machine Forums is pretty good too.
http://www.vbulletin.com/
http://www.simplemachines.org/
August 14th, 2007 at 2:15 pm
I think there should be final “Goodbye to Signposts” parties (get-togethers) as we had at Newport last Sunday.
There should be one in Melbourne & one in Sydney for whomever to try & get to where people can remember the last four years. We were planning on having one in Sydney for Xmas anyway - perhaps it could co-incide.
Such highlights for remembrance & glass-raising could be : -
“Principals Son & high-profile Christian worship leader drags possum watched by horrified picnickers” (my personal fave)
“Lance versus Homer - a war of words that would never reach resolution” (ahhh…the old days where there were threats & swearing)
“Greg’s cheesiest attemps at humour”
“Reve challenges Fraser over Blackstump’s record of social acceptance”
“God & Homosexuality - is anyone in this thread ACTUALLY GAY or do they just like talking about it?”
Lionfish’s crusade to “see the books”
“Geoff sets the record straight”
What else could be added here?
August 14th, 2007 at 2:16 pm
Well, I’ve had a look at vbulletin, simplemachines and getvanilla and even in their most simple state..they all look a bit too hard and bothersome for a non-geek like me.
So wordpress it is …
http://signposts2.wordpress.com
Featuring a brand new CCC tithing mini-sermon exclusive to Signposts2…..’The reason we give is so that we get’.
http://signposts2.wordpress.com/2007/08/13/the-reason-we-give-is-so-that-we-can-get/
I get the impression that Signposts2 will be like the ABC’s digital channel ABC2…no-one will watch it.
August 14th, 2007 at 2:34 pm
And another get together for all of the signposters in Alice Springs?
Anyone,
Anyone?
Well, I’ll have a drink on my own then
August 14th, 2007 at 3:15 pm
Hey! I watch ABC2. Ok…. so it’s official Daisy is a meganerd.
August 14th, 2007 at 3:25 pm
Hey Dan & Phil,
I’m going to miss Signposts! I haven’t posted much of late, but was still a regular visitor & have both renewed old friendships & made some valued new ones over the past few years here.
Thanks for hanging in there this long.
Bless you,
Jane
August 14th, 2007 at 5:05 pm
get off your goddam high horse bec.
FYI beccy boo… you may be fortunate to not be one of the very many Australians who’s suffered sexual abuse, but I am not. So screw you with a big axe. I can make light of it because I lived it for 3 years.
you’re still totally missing my point but you know what? who cares.
August 14th, 2007 at 5:13 pm
“I get the impression that Signposts2 will be like the ABC’s digital channel ABC2…no-one will watch it.”
I think it will actually get a lot of traffic when Signposts closes… but I guess it won’t be exactly the same as Signposts, so it will probably lose some people… and gain some new ones!
Lance… you’ve made a huge contribution to Signposts with all the stimulus material you’ve posted and the comments you’ve made, and I can’t imagine anyone else making anything so similar… my vote’s with you!
Still… my husband looked pleased when I told him Signposts was closing, so I’d better take the hint I’ve been blogging too much!!!!
August 14th, 2007 at 5:23 pm
I’m so sorry to hear it Turtleneck… it’s an awful, awful thing…
August 14th, 2007 at 5:27 pm
But I think that your comment needs deleting… it’s way over the line.
August 14th, 2007 at 5:31 pm
And that you ought apologise to Bec.
August 14th, 2007 at 5:57 pm
not gonna happen. Bec can kiss my ass.
August 14th, 2007 at 6:06 pm
turtleneck - I am genuinely, sincerely sorry that you went through that.
That doesn’t mean I’m not still struggling with your comment. I still think it’s a crazy comparison to make.
August 14th, 2007 at 6:18 pm
As you wish. But anyone who says “screw you with a big axe” to a young woman has lost all credibility to criticise the online behaviour of others, in my opinion.
August 14th, 2007 at 8:30 pm
turtleneck wrote, “FYI beccy boo… you may be fortunate to not be one of the very many Australians who’s suffered sexual abuse, but I am not. So screw you with a big axe. I can make light of it because I lived it for 3 years.”
Well, I was sexually abused as a young boy for about three years too, so perhaps I have enough chops to have an opinion in your world view?
I certainly thought the “childcare centre run by paedophiles” comment was in extremely poor taste. Although it is offensive, I didn’t get offended by it mainly because I just file it straight in the “lifes too short” folder and move on.
Your follow-up comments and reactions I do find offensive and sad, however. Having a horrific childhood doesn’t give anyone carte blanche to act like a shithead.
Dic. H.
August 14th, 2007 at 9:28 pm
Dan & Phil (and all guest posters),
Thanks for the community, the humour, the repartee and the banter. It’s been an excellent site. I’ll miss it.
Paul.
August 14th, 2007 at 10:38 pm
Yes, well, where were all you new lurkers when we needed to boost Phil and Dan’s flagging interest in Signposts?
Hmmm…
Anyway…a few diehards have already migrated over to Signposts2 http://signposts2.wordpress.com
As Signposts2 is now a whole day-and-a-half old (and after a day-and-a-half of madly trying to get some fresh content for discussion on there) ..I’m thinking that I will adopt a more responsible approach (now that I’ve just about worked through my very-late adolescence rebellious angst)
I may even ‘come out’ as it were, operating the site from my work persona (radio journalist) rather than the semi-anonymous rantings here.
I’ve got to say though….I really feel like the only way you can get through to some stupid Christians is to yell at them….jolt them into realising that their warped views really do piss people off (no more crudity - hand slap…oh no..that’s the new blog….this is Signposts..I can still go for my life) both inside and outside the faith.
So maybe it will morph more into aggressive reporting and discussion on the church and how it relates to society…rather than outright attack.
I can’t win though I ’spose…since Bobbie H. thinks I’m the anti-Christ…
Anyhoo…. without trying to sound like AVB flogging his book….there are some new posts up on Signposts2 today .. http://signposts2.wordpress.com …’let the dead bury their own dead’ … ‘you’re at the school to evangelise so why not just say so’..and ‘the prostitutes and the tax collector across the road’
One thing that I’m keen to address…is that I’m not happy with the situation that Emblazoned and others have found themselves in.
I suppose I originally thought that once someone leaves a cult-like organisation like Hill$ong…that it would lighten the load for them….and they could enjoy new freedom…but clearly it’s the opposite experience.
There can be a real sense of confusion…disorientation…betrayal…even leaving one of these churches in reasonably peaceful non-conflictual circumstances.
I think there’s a responsibility that if cult-like organisation members are being encouraged to leave ..by us ..or anyone else…that there is an appropriate infrastructure in place to work through the issues arising from leaving.
I don’t know what that looks like..and maybe Tanya Levin might be in a good place to talk about that once she’s had one-on-one discussions with other leavers as a result of her bookstore circuit thingy….
All I know is…that as the pentecostal churches in particular plant more churches, then the need for counselling services in this area is going to sky-rocket…
Maybe an initiative through Beyond Blue? I don’t know.
But as Hill$ong says….’we can’t do everything but we must do something’.
August 14th, 2007 at 11:36 pm
One thing that I’m keen to address…is that I’m not happy with the situation that Emblazoned and others have found themselves in.
I suppose I originally thought that once someone leaves a cult-like organisation like Hill$ong…that it would lighten the load for them….and they could enjoy new freedom…but clearly it’s the opposite experience.
There can be a real sense of confusion…disorientation…betrayal…even leaving one of these churches in reasonably peaceful non-conflictual circumstances.
I think there’s a responsibility that if cult-like organisation members are being encouraged to leave ..by us ..or anyone else…that there is an appropriate infrastructure in place to work through the issues arising from leaving.
Yes, I couldn’t agree more Lance. I think the problem with churches like these is often the preoccupation with numbers and programs at the expense of people. Accordingly, it is seen as expedient to let “hard cases” slip through the system. The problem is that many of these people lose their faith along the way. I see this as a veritable tragedy and I hope that Signposts2 can continue the good work of Signposts in providing a home for the homeless.
I hope that while there is a time and a place for venting and polemic that it might also be a place where we define ourselves in terms of who we are, rather than who we are not. Over the last few years I have learnt that there is one definite way to let the oppressors win - continue to let them dictate the scope of faith, if only be reaction. The right balance between prophetic criticism and positive community is a really hard one to find and I truly pray Lance that you get it right.
August 15th, 2007 at 1:11 am
Well, I’ve partly addressed that in my ‘Sunshine, lollipops & rainbows’ post at Signposts2 http://signposts.wordpress.com
I said that while it won’t be an ‘always look on the bright side of life’ Christian blog…it won’t be an ‘aaarrrghh..we’re all going to die’ blog either.
My role here at Signposts (I saw it as anyway) was to rage against the machine.
Well, now I am the machine..(until somebody can be bothered putting up another alternative Signposts blog…hint ..hint)
I suppose my own distinctives will be -
- More about useful ways to cope with Post Traumatic Stress (that’s been a huge issue for me that wiped out most of the last decade and took me to the brink several times…note to people with PTSD - it does get better..but slower than you would wish..and slower than other people want….which adds more frustration to the journey)
- More about music as a healing force in people’s lives
- More about highlighting examples of what has worked for people, as opposed to Christian programs with good intentions.
- Anything that doesn’t involve too much work.
I suppose that what drives me is the belief that Christianity (particularly pentydom) has become way too separated from reality….and I see my unique role as to bring Christians face to face with that…and in the case of pentys..that usually means..unwillingly.
August 15th, 2007 at 1:13 am
oops…posted the wrong link..but it gives me an AVB-style excuse to self-promote and post the correct link.
http://signposts2.wordpress.com
August 15th, 2007 at 4:24 am
‘FYI beccy boo… you may be fortunate to not be one of the very many Australians who’s suffered sexual abuse, but I am not. So screw you with a big axe. I can make light of it because I lived it for 3 years.
you’re still totally missing my point but you know what? who cares.’
You say you are joking but I don’t think so,
Its amazing tneck how this has bought out the deep anger in your soul, I see this because you are reacting so violently to others offense at your analogy, emotions I have not read before in your posts, I can’t remember anyway.
It lasts longer than 3 years tneck, the repurcusions and residual hurt will last for ever but you can grow stronger and happier. As a 53 year old man I can now tell you I was raped by a bloke on my way home from school when I was an innocent little boy of 5, I think, without going into any details and morbidity, I can speak a little about it. So I was offended by your statement also, but as the posts have been coming I can only sympathise with you and encourage you to seek help. Not that you are useless or pathetic, but that I know you will be helped.
Signposts may be a pile in your eyes but you will probably find more people here who care for you than you will in your church. Best wishes to you.
August 15th, 2007 at 7:04 am
Lance, before SP closes down for good, what a pleasure it has been… Best of luck to you. Now, I am off to be one of the hecklers on the new muppetts tv show.
August 15th, 2007 at 7:06 am
lance - what pleasure it has been to blog with you. Best of luck to you.
August 15th, 2007 at 9:16 am
I’ve had a look at the message board systems suggested by ecognito (thanks mate), and I reckon it’s doable. However, we would need a domain name and web hosting … any suggestions on that? Does anyone know any web hosting people who could give us some space for next to nothing?
As I’ve mentioned previously, I could see this message board working really well in conjunction with a blog such as Lance’s Signposts2. We’d just need to try and integrate the two, which shouldn’t be that hard.
August 15th, 2007 at 9:31 am
GoDaddy have some of the best hosting plans I’ve seen in a long time. Very affordable, good features and good speed. They can also handle the domain name registration for you, so everything in one. (All prices in US dollars.)
http://tinyurl.com/24w9ap
August 15th, 2007 at 9:37 am
I have a professional web designer friend who could probably fix something forumy up. Don’t know who’s planning to take the project on, but whoever it is, let me know if you are interested.
August 15th, 2007 at 1:25 pm
I don’t know about wordpress but if its anything like blogspot Lance you can have a couple of administrators who can post threads and moderate etc..